Mystery of Three Schindler Houses

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Mystery of Three Schindler Houses

Postby ch » Wed Dec 01, 2004 2:58 pm


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Postby L.A.kevin » Wed Dec 01, 2004 3:32 pm


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RMS x 3

Postby SDR » Wed Dec 01, 2004 4:47 pm


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Postby Tony » Sat Dec 11, 2004 5:24 pm

Craig,

Could you elaborate more about your viewing the Schindler Daugherty House in Encino? I drove by the published address of 4635 Louise, but that address does not exist. There is a house at 4631, but that seems to have been built in 1969. And there is an address of 4637, but that is a vacant lot with a long driveway leading to a flat pad. If 4637 was the Daugherty house, it is gone. I am trying to confirm this with the MAK Center and UCSB - so this is not a confirmed loss (as of yet).

Thanks!

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Postby ch » Sun Dec 12, 2004 8:27 am

Tony,

It was years ago that we drove around Encino trying to find this house. I do remember some confusion as the numbers and you are right - there is no 4635 posted street address. According to what I have, the original Daugherty property was subdivided into 4 building lots. We did drive up and down some of those long driveways - our lust for Schindler overcoming the desire to respect owner's privacy. What can I say? At any rate, I do remember one particularly ramshackle house that was overgrown with vegetation and we not getting real close we assumed it was Daugherty. Perhaps we were mistaken or perhaps this is the now vacant lot?

Is there a way to check LA County assessor's office for tax records? Please let me know what you find. I think it's interesting after all this time and interest in Schindler that some of his works are still not verified as standing.

Regards.

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Daugherty House

Postby SDR » Sun Dec 12, 2004 11:18 am

Craig -- Where did you find mention of the purple floor -- I haven't seen that before. It is surprising that a Schindler house would remain unresearched. The plan published by J Sheine doesn't show the whole lot, but there seems to be an oak tree on an island (?) in the driveway, a free-standing garage to the left (against a bank?) with the house ahead to the right at a diagonal, addressing the view. . .

Anyway, thanks for the good news about Erlik. I think full-scale restorations are now happening more frequently than ever -- awareness and recognition are increasing?

SDR

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Daugherty House

Postby ch » Sun Dec 12, 2004 12:20 pm

SDR,

I will try to find the exact text about the floor color. I remember reading it in some discussion about Schindler's color choices and it described the concrete floors as integrally tinted an "eggplant" color. The plot plan I mentioned is in the Architectural Drawings of R.M. Schindler - a four volume set that contains most of RMS' drawings.

More as I can find it...

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Postby Tony » Mon Dec 13, 2004 3:00 pm

Looks to me that the Daugherty house is gone. UCSB confirmed the address of 4635 Louise in Encino. An address which does not exist. 4631 is a house built in 1969 and 4637 is a large vacant lot with a driveway and flat pad. Most probably Daugherty once sat on that pad.

Lost another one!

But if you look at the building list in David Gebhard's Schindler book, it is rather shocking to see how many buildings were destroyed by 1971, the year of the printing.

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Daugherty House

Postby SDR » Mon Dec 13, 2004 3:32 pm

Well, if someone wants to re-create a Schindler house on its original site (has that ever been done?), there's a purple pad waiting for them in Encino!

I'm waiting for the Re-Creation-of-Lost-Structures market to awaken. The German Pavilion of Mies, in Barcelona, has been re-created there. Taliesin Associated Architects have offered to discuss, with interested clients, the re-creation of Wright designs. I would guess that, for what the owners paid to have the Kauffman House (Palm Springs) restored, one could build a new copy of the Pauson House (Phoenix). (Well, maybe a smaller Usonian?) Where the original architect (or his successors) are available, authenticity would be more or less assured. Surviving documentation would assist other architects to re-create original buildings, incorporating technical and mechanical upgrades as necessary and appropriate.

I understand the (Usonian) Pope-Leighey House of Wright has now been relocated and rebuilt twice! (The woodwork was saved, while new brick masonry was created, at least in the first reconstruction.)

SDR

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Postby johnnyapollo » Mon Dec 13, 2004 4:18 pm

There's supposed to be a Wright designed, Wright Foundation built structure near the Emory University campus (I haven't yet found or examined it). My understanding is that it was built posthumously and is frequently used as a chapel (though I may be way off base on the latter). My research has led to this: http://www.emoryconferencecenter.com/

Not really a FLW-designed structure, but rather one "inspired" by him.

-- Best, John

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Postby Tony » Mon Dec 13, 2004 4:40 pm

I've always been interested in the concept of recreations of lost buildings. Albert Frey's Frey House I in Palm Springs would be a good one. Perhaps the late Pierre Koenig's Koenig House I also. It is now underneath the Glendale Freeway.

I know of two recreations, or rather partial duplicates, of existing John Lautner houses. There is a copy of the Pearlman Mountain Cabin, also in Idylwild. And there is a copy of the Bergren House in Snow Creek, outside of Palm Springs.

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Re-Creations

Postby ch » Mon Dec 13, 2004 6:45 pm

This is an interesting topic with many variations. You have both the Neutra/Kaufmann and the Schindler/Erik which are posthumous restorations that involve stripping away later additions. I remember reading about a new purchaser of the Schindler/Skolnik house who said she didn't want all the added extra space and planned on taking the house back to its original footprint (does anyone know if this ever happened?)

You also have architects returning to their original but changed designs and restoring them (Case Study House #21/Koenig).

Then you have architects re-building a lost house for the second time (Bergren/Lautner) and lastly, re-creations of built but torn down houses after the architect has died, never-built designs and houses based on an original design.

I know there are several great designs I have often thought of (re-)building but since my favorite SoCal architect is Schindler, his on site supervision would be lost and so how could such a structure really be the same? Thoughts?

Craig

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Redo-s

Postby SDR » Mon Dec 13, 2004 7:11 pm

Welll. . .If you re-constructed a (Schindler) house that you had good as-built documentation of, it would presumably reflect accurately even the most spontaneous "field decisions" of the architect-builder (the best kind of architect, sez I). No? On the other hand, what do you say to the idea that for any composition, whether musical, painted, or architectural, the "performance" initially displayed is only one of an infinite number of very similar but still distinguishable variations, with weather conditions, mood, available materials, lighting, and the skills and abilities of all concerned contributing to each unique performance. Would such a theory, if accepted, allow for "new takes" on existing designs -- particularly when the original maker was in the habit of trying something new with each of his own "performances"?

I'm glad there's already a list of such events -- let's continue.

SDR :cheers:

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Postby Tony » Mon Dec 13, 2004 7:31 pm

Yes, it depends upon the level of documentation of the demolished house. As has been noted, Schindler's later works were rather poorly detailed by RMS. He left much to be decided on-site. That would make replication (ah, Replicants) more difficult.

On the other hand, the restoration of the Kaufman House in Palm Springs was guided by Julius Shulman's photographs. So if a house has been as well documented, perhaps it could be recreated.

And what about houses that were never built? The Josephine Baker house in Paris, by Loos. Could that be created?

And to correct a previous post, regarding the inexact duplicate of the Bergren house. The original still exists.

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Recreations

Postby ch » Mon Dec 13, 2004 7:40 pm

Hi Tony,

I read in the Lautner monograph that the original Bergren house had been destroyed by fire. The owner was so happy with the design that he brought Lautner back to rebuild it exactly as it had been. At least that is what the book says - maybe it's not true?

(In any event, it's always been another of my favorite small houses).

Craig

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Postby Tony » Mon Dec 13, 2004 7:48 pm

Craig,

Got me! I'll have to ask Frank Escher. The Bergren House exists. And has sold twice this year. It's one of my favorites. I think architects work best under constraints. And designing a small house is a real constraint. I'm very familiar with this house and like it a lot.

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houses to love

Postby SDR » Mon Dec 13, 2004 8:38 pm

Alan Hess dates the Bergren to 1951, "rebuilt and expanded" (1953) after a fire; Lautner dates it to 1953 and remembers that after a fire "years later," "an exact replica" was built "without a change." This is what drives hardworking historians nuts. I guess you're both right! (I saw the house during a Schindler house tour in the late 'nineties.) If there's a copy in Palm Springs, I wonder when it was built?

I could be perfectly satisfied if every second modern house was by either Schindler or Lautner, I believe. . .the lovely slatted Schaffer is a particular favorite; the living room ceiling owes more than a little to RMS, and the rest to youthful exhuberance? And speaking of stripes:

The world would be a better place if Loos's Baker House had been built; maybe it ISN'T too late!

SDR

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Eggplant Colored Floors

Postby ch » Mon Dec 27, 2004 6:55 pm

I knew I didn't dream this. I finally found the citation of the eggplant colored concrete floors of the Daugherty House. It's mentioned in the Judith Sheine book, "R.M. Schindler, published by Phaidon. On page 208 she notes, "the concrete floor of the living space, which contained radiant hot water heating pipes, was stained a light eggplant color."

As I librarian it drives me nuts when I can't find something...

Regards,

Craig

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Postby SDR » Mon Dec 27, 2004 8:21 pm

Ooh, that's the one I don't have. Thank you -- I hope you haven't been on it this whole time! Multiple sources do pay off -- each one has material not found elsewhere, and (hopefully) that goes for images, too.

Craig, have you been to the Pueblo Ribera project in La Jolla? If so, what did you see? What other Schindler experiences could you relate?

Of the houses I saw on tour, I think the Kallis sticks with me -- the outdoor deck between the main house and the studio has been enclosed (by Schindler?) -- I would have liked to see it as originaly built.

Wonder if somebody will hire Marmol+Radziner (?) to replicate the Wolfe, on Santa Catalina. . .

SDR

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Postby Tony » Thu Dec 30, 2004 12:19 pm

I have not been in one of the Schindler units in La Jolla. Walked around it two years or so ago on a tour I did for MOCA. Generally, it was in better shape than I expected, given the historically terrible concrete. Now that they are so expensive, they seem to be getting fixed up.

One unit was lost by fire, decades ago. A few years ago it was finally replaced. This was done at a larger scale, in a "Schindleresque" style. So while new, it does blend in fairly well.

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Pueblo Ribera

Postby SDR » Thu Dec 30, 2004 1:33 pm

While the project was originally under single ownership, I take it that the units are now individually owned?

Thanks for the notes. I am looking for a (university?) publication I think I own, in which a researcher reports on her study of the complex as it exists now, with (small-scale) sections through un-altered as well as altered units, and notes on conditions. Many of the second-story sleeping porches have been enclosed, for instance.

SDR

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Postby Tony » Thu Dec 30, 2004 2:07 pm

Yes, the units turned into condominums some time ago.

When I was researching San Diego about two years ago I remember finding a website that had 3-D fly-throughs of one of the units. Also, one of the owners had a website on their unit. Not sure if I still have the links, but I'll look.

For information on modern architecture in San Diego, check out:

www.modernsandiego.com

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Fly-through

Postby SDR » Thu Dec 30, 2004 2:18 pm

Thanks, Tony -- I found that fly-through too -- still have it somewhere in my previous OS. I'll check out the SD site.

SDR

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Postby Tony » Thu Dec 30, 2004 2:28 pm

When you get a chance, please post the URL's for those sites.

Thanks!

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Pueblo Ribera

Postby ch » Thu Dec 30, 2004 7:27 pm

Here is a real treat. The Library of Congress has something called the American Memory, their online collection. Included in this material is the Historic American Buildings Survey/Historic American Engineering Record from 1933-Present.

If you go to their site: http://memory.loc.gov/ammem/index.html

Or the site for this particular collection: http://memory.loc.gov/ammem/collections ... index.html

and search key words "Pueblo Ribera" you will get some great vintage photos and data about the project. If you search under "Schindler" there are other projects as well. One of my other favorites is the Lloyd Wright Sowden house - really great pics.

Happy viewing!

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Postby SDR » Fri Dec 31, 2004 12:42 pm


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Postby MD² » Sat Sep 17, 2005 10:21 am

Last edited by MD² on Thu Nov 30, 2006 8:04 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Postby Tony » Sat Sep 17, 2005 11:37 am

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Schindler's Erlik House Restoration

Postby ch » Thu Nov 30, 2006 3:46 am

This is a late add to this old thread but I just stumbled across it and found it interesting. Here is the link to the page of the architect who did the Erlik restoration. There are interesting before and after photos.




I knew that the owner had reduced the size back to the original footprint, but apparently 1990 sq. ft was removed to return the house back to its original 1175 sq. ft. size. Now that's a true Schindler fan!

ORIGINAL, PREVIOUS STATE and AFTER
Image


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